No, of course you’re not a liar. I shall be contacting you about this privately, hon. x

I would say no. I am amused at the comments on the journal. Mostly the one that equates it with herpes.

I would say no. I am amused at the comments on the journal. Mostly the one that equates it with herpes.

I find it bizarre that once someone finds out that a person is trans, they suddenly feel entitled to know about the surgical state of the genitals and make assumptions based on that.

You’re not lying, you’re presenting yourself the same way you live — as a woman. The only people who honestly need to know any further are intimate partners (or, if you’re like me and get pre-emptive about it, prospective intimate partners). And that’s only until one is post-op… (although personally, I think it’d be a little suffocating to be in a relationship with someone who didn’t know and to have to hide it / never talk about it).

Quote: What I’ve learned in my life is that MOST men and women are full of shit when they say it’s more about love than it is genitals.

Oh, I don’t know, I’m more interested in the person than the parts attached, but I’m bisexual. So that’s easy for me. My partner’s going in for her surgery soon, and I don’t really believe that her change in genitalia is going to change how I feel about her for the better or worse. Feel free to check back with me in a few months on that.

Either way, I do think that bi- folk have an easier time of wrapping their brains around us, especially if dating during a time when someone is approaching surgery or working toward it — and trans bi- folk even moreso.

no, you’re not being dishonest, but you’re also avoiding (or purposely neglecting to identify) a particular fact about yourself that is a deal breaker for a majority of the population. so i’d say that you’re probably being either unrealistic or naive, or perhaps a bit of both.

that may seem harsh, but from my experience, i see the world’s population in two groups. those that don’t care that i’m trans, and those that do care. i want nothing to do with those people who care that i’m trans. when i was looking for dates, i was very upfront about my transness. and that filtered out all the people for whom it would be a deal breaker. and that worked well for both me and them. neither of us wasted our time or energy on someone with whom we could not build a successful relationship.

see, for those people, “deceiving” them about my transness would be seen as dishonest, and they would never have wasted their time with a mere trans woman. and for me, honesty is one of the primary building blocks in a successful relationship. and for the people who don’t care, being upfront about my transness didn’t amount to a hill of beans. so it certainly couldn’t hurt my chances with an eligible partner.

and regarding the infamous “tranny chasers” who would date me just because i’m trans, well, i’ll be honest. some of them were really nice guys who i dated for a while. and some of them were assholes, who i didn’t date for very long. you know, welcome to womanhood – some guys (or gals) are assholes, and just want to get in your pants because, well, they can.

either way, you’re going to kiss a lot of frogs before your find your prince or princess.

No, you are definitely NOT a liar. You are one of the most honest and straightforward people I met on the net. Hey, you are the one who admitted you are a trans to that person in OkCupid, that is an act of HONESTY.

So if she has a problem with it, it remains her problem. It is amazing how most people deal with other people by the basis of a sex orgain rather than a person.

“either way, you’re going to kiss a lot of frogs before your find your prince or princess.”

I totally agree with Nexy here, I kissed so many frogs my lips turned GREEN (Yikes!). Fortunately, my husband do not mind my lips being used to green and painted it red again. So if I can find one, I see no problems with that.

All it takes is patience and time, love and tenderness. Whoever learns to love you Marti, would really love you. That is better than rushing for someone who may end up using you or worse, trying to take your life on the first date with the guise of being ‘cheated’ by a trans.

No, you weren’t lying. Selectively withholding information is not lying. Everyone withholds information on dating sites. Unfortunately, from what I’ve heard from friends, profiles that explicitly state that someone is trans don’t get many responses, and some of the responses they do get are from fetishists. Since you linked to your blogs, the accusation of lying is even more ludicrous.

My partner and I met online, and her profile made no reference to the way she was born. I was pretty ignorant of trans issues at the time (I’d never actually met anyone I knew was trans) and when I found out, I reacted badly because I was ignorant. After the initial bad reaction I educated myself and apologized profusely for being such an ass. She forgave me. We’re still together, I’m an advocate, and the rest is history.

My point here is that even you choose to tell someone after you’ve been talking to them for awhile, and even if there’s an initial freak-out, they may get over it and decide it doesn’t matter to them. Hell, you may even make any advocate of them, not just a date/partner. You’re not doing anything wrong. I’d say you’re doing a lot of things right!

No, you are not lying. You state that you are Trans in the profile, that is all they need to know at this time. At some time in the future when a face to face meeting happens and you have detirmined that you want to know this person much more itintimatly, that is the time to divulge more details.

I have counseled a number of trans folk on getting a job. I tell them that it is no ones bussiness whether or not that are trans until a interview happens. This is the time that a prospective employer has the right and the need to know about the gender status.

I find most transfollk to be very honest. Maybe to much so.

@nexy:

I agree to a certain extent, but I find that starting out by saying, “hi….I’m trans! How are you” has a chilling effect on having someone see you as anything other than trans. It’s what is really hard in all of this. As far as tranny chasers, hell…I’m one myself. It wasn’t meant as a pejorative. I just really don’t want someone seeking me out for sex. I like transgender people as partners because they understand what I’m going through. So much of the struggles that I go through, I don’t have to explain.

@Nicole:

LOL. Well, I don’t see herpes as a deal breaker, but I would want someone to tell me before we ever considered intimacy.

@somethingtobe:

Ya, I do keep you both in mind. I really do think you’re awesome, even if you don’t post to TA (hint, hint). :p

I do believe that the moment that it’s talked about should be before ANY physical intimacy is shared.

Some good stuff here! But what on earth does Patti mean by saying potential employers have a need/right to know gender status????!!! They don’t, unless things are VERY different in the US. Felix (UK)

Felix,
They have a need to know because not all records get and stay changed. One of the most common questions on an employment application is, “Have you ever been known by another name?”. If it ever comes out and it may, your employer should know this ahead of time to head off problems from other employees and not be blindsided. You may feel the need to hide this from your employer, but I feel they should know and that should be the end of the discussion, unless the employer intends to be discriminatory which as time goes forth less and less are doing.

Patti,

Wouldn’t that entitle employers to know about any previous names? For many of us, that means coming out, but for others it doesn’t. My parents gave me a gender neutral name and I haven’t changed it. If I had changed it, telling people my old name wouldn’t out me as trans.

And even if there is something else they would need to know that would out you, wouldn’t it be better to wait until after the interview? I mean, if I’ve got a same-sex partner, I’ll have to eventually tell HR in order to get domestic partner (as opposed to spousal) benefits. But usually that’s not something that I bring up in the interview — and I believe employers aren’t allowed to ask about it. I’ve always thought it’s better to avoid the opportunity for discrimination and wait until your position is final. That seems to be how non-discrimination laws are set up in other areas.

You may have a point. I was not refering to being Gay. In that I agree that it is none of their business period. As far as being Trans, most the time they will find out anyway (SS records and such). I feel that it is being honest with the employer. You might be able to get away with it if you transitioned while very young, but a great many of us aren’t in that boat.

Ah, that makes sense. In addition to being young, I’m lucky enough to telecommute and I had a phone interview. Now I’m racing the clock to see if I can change my SS records before they get reviewed along with the tax season.

Thanks for your posts, Patti and Tobi. Employers in the UK are not allowed to ask any questions about your gender or partner’s details. They may ask about previous names to cross-check criminal records and National Insurance contributions but that’s all. If “John” shows up as formerly “Mary”, for example they are not allowed to disclose this to anyone except those colleagues for whom it is necessary for record-keeping. If they do we can take legal action against them. Any mention of an employee’s sexuality is also illegal unless it is to that employee to ascertain they are getting the benefits to which other couples are entitled. Transpeople can have birth certificates changed if they wish and the whole paper chase destroyed but not all of us do so

Thanks for your posts, Patti and Tobi. Employers in the UK are not allowed to ask any questions about your gender or partner’s details. They may ask about previous names to cross-check criminal records and National Insurance contributions but that’s all. If “John” shows up as formerly “Mary”, for example they are not allowed to disclose this to anyone except those colleagues for whom it is necessary for record-keeping. If they do we can take legal action against them. Any mention of an employee’s sexuality is also illegal unless it is to that employee to ascertain they are getting the benefits to which other couples are entitled. Transpeople can have birth certificates changed if they wish and the whole paper chase destroyed but not all of us do so

“…I find that starting out by saying, “hi….I’m trans! How are you” has a chilling effect on having someone see you as anything other than trans.

as opposed to saying “My name is Marti, and I’m a little bit fruity. What does that mean? It’s an easy way to say that I’m queer.”?

are you saying that stating in your first paragraph of your profile that you’re fruity and queer has less of a chilling effect than saying you’re trans? it’s ok that people see you as anything other than queer, but anything other than trans is not ok?

Sorry… (sheepish)… I’ll post soon. Haven’t had time for my political writing lately because we just moved in to a new apartment and my life is still in boxes.

The girl you were talking with obviously made a judgment against you and called you a liar. So what, block her on OkCupid. Not sure that i see any point to focusing on this topic as you have no control over her reaction or how she feels about transgendered people and dating. Seems it’s in your better interest to refocus your energy on trying to make new, positive lasting relationships with people who will like you for who you are, as an individual.

@nexy:

Stating my sexual orientation is flexible is different that saying what my genital configuration is. I don’t want people seeing me as trans first… I want them to see ME as a person.

@Jillian:

She has every right to make that judgment and I think she’s pretty awesome. It’s not a big deal to me, really. Just an observation from two different vantage points.

Do you think I’m being dishonest?

No chance.

My two cents:

You’re not being dishonest nor should you change anything, unless you believe it is best for you.

For this other person you are being dishonest, but that is their issue, not yours.

Take care,
Jay